CAMERAS ON EVERYWHERE!!!!!

[numenorian]

I started this topic because i heard from TV that many countries(goverments not the ppl) re willing to put cameras in order to 'avoid' crimes etc.I must say im tottaly opposed to that it's tottaly antidemocratic and honestly i believe that those who believe the opposite re facists(maybe more fasists than Hitler).To sum up I m tellin you that these re the results of the 'Terrorism propaganda' that the western goverments say to their ppl.When you re afraid you cannot do anything else than accept everything that your "saviour" says.

[LOTRfan1414]

I agree with you on this one numenorian,  I do not like the government videotaping our every move. Its just like themlistening into our calls, where is our freedom of privacy?

[numenorian]

I might send you far right now but i believe that the previous day before they put cameras(dont know when im just saying) the goverments will say "we re taking measures against terrorism for the citizens' safety".

[Beren One-Hand]

That kind of thing is total invasion of privacy.  Governments do as they see fit and re-write laws to their advantage.  Corruption and politics are inseparable.  As it is said: "Absolute power corrupts absolutly."

[Zaku]

The cameras are in public places.
If I may call forward the quote I always use for this issue:
"News flash. When you're in public, PEOPLE CAN SEE YOU."

There's nothing wrong with putting up a few cameras. People are just over-paranoid after reading 1984 and now any kind of surveillance gets labelled as "1984-ish".

There's nothing "fascist" about keeping an eye on the streets, subways, etc. Are they telling you what to do? How to act? What to say? To believe? Hell, are they even "invading" and privacy that isn't "invaded" by the everyday passerby?
Just what exactly is so fascist about it?

[Andúnië]

Good point. Most of the cameras installed in public are in very public places where you are seen by hundreds of other people anyways. The existance of the cameras is to provide extra security. It's for the general good. As long as the surveillance remains on public property, there is no invasion of privacy. I would object to being watched closely everywhere I go, but the people monitoring these don't follow individuals and track them down unless there's something they suspect to be suspicious.

[lothlorien]

I like the idea of putting cameras up in public places, especially in known crime areas.  For example.....Central Park.

As far as I'm concerned, I'm not doing anything illegal, I don't plan to do anything that's wrong or immoral, so I could care less if I'm walking on  a sidewalk and a camera snaps a picture.  I don't care, as long as after a certain period of time, the files are destroyed and not published somewhere.

My kids and  I were in a shopping center and there was a promotion going on and these young men were giving out snack bars to all the kids.  As  soon as the one kid pulled out a cameral and tried snapping pictures, I yelled at him.  I didn't want my kids pictures to end up in some campain somewhere, without my permission.  He didn't have the right to take my kids pictures without my permission.  That I don't agree with.

[numenorian]

I m tottaly against cameras,because i don't think that they ll be used for a good purpose and we ll have lots of blackmails.No tottaly against it

[Zaku]

I m tottaly against cameras,because i don't think that they ll be used for a good purpose and we ll have lots of blackmails.No tottaly against it

Okay, what bad purpose could the government use while taping public places? "If u don't give us teh cashz we will tell ev3ryone u pikked ur nose!!"

[numenorian]

Im not goin to give no reason why i believe that and i ll tell you why,because a guy who thinks can understand easily......

[Zaku]

If you're not going to give me a reason how are we supposed to debate this?

[Andúnië]

I agree with Lothlorien's stance on the example she gave. People should not photograph or tape others for their own purposes unless they have permission to. However, surveillance is surveillance. This is for safety. Nothing malign is going to be done with these tapes.

I m tottaly against cameras,because i don't think that they ll be used for a good purpose and we ll have lots of blackmails.No tottaly against it

Since when have these been used for blackmail? Many of them are used by the government. Who has been blackmailed yet? There is nothing wrong with being seen by a camera if it is not going to be used. If you go out in public at all, hundreds of people see you anyways. Cameras are used generally in public locations of high traffic, people can get away with a lot of things otherwise. Of course, I am not opting for being watched 24/7, but that's not the case either. I am also protective of my privacy, but there is no intrusion of privacy here. As much as I like anonymity, I would feel much safer in a public place with cameras.

There's nothing wrong with putting up a few cameras. People are just over-paranoid after reading 1984 and now any kind of surveillance gets labelled as "1984-ish".

There's nothing "fascist" about keeping an eye on the streets, subways, etc. Are they telling you what to do? How to act? What to say? To believe?

This is precisely right. We are not being controlled by camera-wielding people. The only information ever gleaned from tapes and used is to identify and catch law-breakers.

[Pulsifer]

My workplace is camera-monitored, and I really appreciate it. No less than twelve times have I:

1) Used the photographic evidence to prove I'm innocent. (ex. when two drunk american for-hire workers attempted to beat me up for refusing to open the kiosk at 01.00 in the night)
2) Captured people in the middle of theft.
3) Reviewed situations where we have been subject for complaints to our company. In four out of six cases we were absolved of all guilt, the other two were far less serious than the complainers would have it seem.

It's also a great boon for the Securitas who work camp security.

Surveilance in public spaces is also a non-issue to me.

[numenorian]

Thats the positives of havin cameras but for instance imagine someone getting monitored about his ideas and beliefs that come against the goverment(im not saying being a vandal and destroying everything) believes is it right gettin monitored cause of that?

[Pulsifer]

Thats the positives of havin cameras but for instance imagine someone getting monitored about his ideas and beliefs that come against the goverment(im not saying being a vandal and destroying everything) believes is it right gettin monitored cause of that?

Well, when you Americans do that, you call it surveilance, I believe. Or wiretapping. So you're really in a more experienced position to say what you believe that than I am.

I don't believe in a blanket opening for surveilance of individuals, but I can approve of it some cases. If a person is inciting civil or armed dissent, encouraging violence, encouraging bigotry, encouraging breaking the law, or such,then monitoring his activity to gather evidence and put him in forth of a trial is something I approve of.

See, the evil isn't really in the information being gathered. Information is information; it just exists. The evil is  what is done with such information. Now, in the Big Brother society you're obviously referring to, a person with scary behaviour would be . . . disappeared. And that's when you have a police state on your hands. A democratic and/or fair state would gather the information, then apply due process.

Of course, I'm positing here that the government really believes, deep down, that the person is breaking the law, intending to or inciting others to do so. If they do not have such a basis and is just putting him under surveilance because he's different, that would be illegal.